Dr. Kadri Obafemi Hamzat, deputy governor of Lagos State and All Progressives Congress, (APC), governorship candidate, spoke with reporters in Lagos on his plans, preparations for the poll and why President Bola Ahmed Tinubu is the best bet for Nigeria in 2027. Excerpts by DECENCY GLOBAL NEWS.
Why do you think Nigerians should re-elect President Bola Tinubu?
There are a lot of reasons. But you must also look at the people he’s contesting against. Mr Peter Obi has been governor, Alhaji Atiku Abubakar has been Vice President, Rabiu Kwankwaso has been governor. The question is what have these people done? What has Peter Obi done as a governor that you think he will do well as a President? The President was building his political party. Even in the last election, Tinubu fought his party, and didn’t leave. I recall during campaign in Abeokuta when Tinubu said, “They may choose to money, food scarce, we’ll still go for the election and win.”
Compare that to a man who will be a member of a party in the morning and another at night. He will be catastrophic as a President. If you can’t fight for something, you will fall for anything. You want to rule a nation of 200 million people and you can’t stand for something! APGA in the morning, PDP at night! Look at other nations. President Donald Trump fought in the primaries. Where will you run to, as President, when you have challenges? Will you run away or you will confront it just like the President is confronting it today? When it comes to saving the state, what are you willing to do? The President confronted the issue. He said, let’s remove subsidy. Do we remember why our refineries don’t work? Was it not because we said let’s introduce subsidy in 1992? And all our refineries were dead. It was supposed to be short term, but look at what we did to ourselves.
I have been talking to young men in the private sector and what they tell me is that, because the macro has improved, their businesses are doing extremely well. One of them told me that, the company was started 15 years ago, and they were about 48, but within the last two years, they are now 400 employees. I challenged him for not speaking out and he said they are businessmen out to make profit and they are not politicians. They all promised then that subsidy will go. I recall then that former Vice President, Atiku Abubakar said subsidy will go; Mr Peter Obi said subsidy is a scam. And when implementation started, we started hearing something different. You can’t do that, as a leader. Our oil production is going up. We are said to have had the highest production in 74 months of about 1.7 million barrels a day.
When President Tinubu took over, it was about 800,000 barrels. It is now almost double. There is Technical and Vocational Education and Training. If you go to London, you see plumbers, and other artisans, they don’t have shops, they just have trucks, with their phone numbers asking you to call them for their services. That is how they built their country. The President is building the fundamentals. Nobody says it will be easy.
If you have malaria, most medications are bitter. If you’re injured, you go for surgery, it is painful. There must be rehabilitation. Before now, we all heard of airlines shut down, Emirates did not come to our country for two years because they couldn’t get their money. The N23 trillion Ways and Means has been cleared. So, what will these people do different? They can’t even manage a political party. How will they manage this country? For me, it is a very easy choice. I also meet him, discuss with him and I can see his vision. You may say I am biased but we can all see what he is doing. The President is embarking on an enormous amount of infrastructure, across our country: Sokoto-Badagry road; Lagos-Calabar Coastal Highway. I remember in 2023, they asked me this same question and I said, how can you compare a goat to a lion? Comparing them is a no-brainer. I am sure Nigerians will vote for him. There are many distractions and political liars all over the place but when people actually see what is happening, I am confident that President Tinubu will come back again, and the country will be better for it.
Your party was hit by a calamity of monumental proportion in the 2023 election when President Bola Tinubu lost the presidential election in Lagos. What is your party doing to avert this in the 2027 election?
We did some sort of an autopsy to see what happened, and we saw many things. We saw that we assumed many things. We didn’t take care of a lot of things, as a party. We didn’t move a lot of the pillars that we normally move, in terms of talking to people here and there, and we have tried to correct that so that this time around, it will be better.
Local Government autonomy, despite the Supreme Court judgment of about two years ago, still is yet to be fully implemented in many states, how do we empower local government administrations to be more effective?
For Lagos, the autonomy ruling does not really affect us because we have never touched their resources. We collaborate because of inherent problems that we have had before. Local government pays primary school teachers so at a time, they were owing. But our President, when he was governor, said this must stop, because when the news comes out, it is Lagos State owes primary school teachers. So, we said, let us do this as first line charge. So, the moment your money comes, we take out teachers’ salaries. We collaborate also on different areas like land use charge, ground rent, neighbourhood charge with some to be collected by state and others by local government.
So, we decided that rather than an individual receiving three bills from government, we give just one bill and we divide behind the scene. There is a board to do this that includes local government chairmen. We collaborate to make it easier for our citizens. We don’t actually do anything with their money. Now that the resources are higher, we need to make sure that we work together because we are serving the same citizens. And for the state, anything we do is in one local government or the other. Part of what we will be doing is creating a new approach where we will be meeting on a monthly basis to do peer review, do assessment and giving ourselves assignment as a team. And we can see who is achieving what we agreed on or who is not, and we call ourselves to be more responsive to the needs of our people.
What factors led to the choice of your running mate?
The moment I emerged, I know that it is important that the deputy is a Christian, since I am a Muslim; and a lot of our women leaders have been saying they have tolerated us men for eight years, we must have a female. And we agreed that it made sense. And a lot of other people also said that we needed younger minds. Also, I am from the East; the current governor is from Central; so we said let it go to the West. So, all those came together. And Damilola Sonayon-James emerged. She was the Deputy Women Leader of our state. She was a supervisor in Badagry and then we looked at everything she had been doing, and she emerged.
There are still grievances from the last primaries of the party, what is your agenda for them?
That is ongoing; if not for this interview, I will be meeting some people now on that issue. So, the Constitution of our country states that you cannot run for election unless you are nominated by a political party. So the political party is supreme because you are representing that brand, and as such, there are many factors that come in in the selection of where the party moves. In some cases, we say the number of females is not enough, let us get more females, and if you settle down on a constituency or an area, the men there will complain. There are so many factors. I was meeting with many aspirants and I said, in 2019, I took my form two days before Governor Babajide Sanwo-Olu but the leaders called me and said, ‘You are a Muslim; Asiwaju was a Muslim for eight years; BRF was a Muslim; Governor Akinwunmi Ambode is not coming back; let a Christian go; and I said, fair enough.’ And I did a press conference and stepped down. And they looked at that and took me as deputy. It is because they talked to me and I listened. So, maybe if I didn’t listen then, today would not have arrived. So people must learn from that, because there would be many factors that we would have to consider. Unfortunately, when it comes to the emergence of the king of a community, even siblings have issues, but there can only be one king at that time. So, we tell ourselves that, if it doesn’t happen now, you don’t know tomorrow. So, let’s calm down. That process has started and hopefully we will be able to get everybody to understand that things will get better for all of us.
How is the party also handling the Justice Forum/Mandate Movement blocs amid fears that one group may be sidelined if you become governor?
I have met with the two groups. The truth of the matter is that the mother and the father is the Justice Forum. What happened was that it was a group set up by the leadership then to meet because politics was banned by the military. So, it predates 1999. And I have asked the question, what is the philosophical difference between the two? It is zero. So, let us calm down. Don’t let’s use what doesn’t exist to divide ourselves. People make the argument that even in advanced democracies like the United States, that there is the Black caucus, there is the Freedom caucus in the Republican. But there are philosophical differences. The Freedom caucus believes that even in case of incest and rape, a child should be born. Others say they don’t like abortion but in the case of incest, rape. So, there are philosophical differences. Here, what are the philosophical differences? Nothing. So, we cannot be a political party that runs after crumbs and fight ourselves. No. We must rise above that. And I think that everybody seems to understand that now.
If it comes down to stepping on toes, including party leaders, in the interest of moving Lagos ahead, will you do that?
The reality is, you need the collective will of the people to move a state forward. You can’t fight people and say you are just fighting everybody, you will lose. You can’t fight many battles. You can fight some battles but is it not better when you let people see what you want to do. We are all human beings and we have different opinions. Some people might genuinely believe that that goal is wrong. So, it is not a question of crushing their leg but it is to say that it is for the greatest good for the greatest number of people. As a human being, we will never be perfect but this is what my brain can take and this is the direction that we want to go, and you go. But, as much as possible, I think it is better to convince people to let people see why you want to do something. Remember, human beings are naturally selfish, that thing might not be good for that person personally and he might not see the bigger picture. So, it is the responsibility of the leaders to let people see the bigger picture for their children and grandchildren. Hopefully, you are able to convince nine out of 10 people, and then you move.
Talking about organisation, how do you deal with the issue of louts across the city and clearing the blocked waterways which have structures on it without stepping on toes?
What separates us from the so-called developed nations are the rule of law and technology. Part of what you talk about is the rule of law. The organisation is this is where you should be, but you are here. And the rule of law is to say this is where you should be and that is where you would be. You must think about the common good. I recall when we were building the Okota main road. It would have been a lagoon today. But today, the place is clear. When we go there to campaign, I will tell them, it will be unGodly not to vote for our party in that place because those who know what it was and what we went through on that project. We were in court for nine months. We were building the road, we expanded it, we were building massive drains. We have the drain about 1.2 kilometres beyond the road because we can’t go further. It will be too destructive. As we were building, a house was obstructing the road construction. We promised compensation, the building owner declined. He went to court. We were to pay N60 million as agreement but the court said N12 million. Then we demolished and paid him N12 million. Even the neighbours said they told him. Today, they are driving freely in Okota, without issue of flooding. It is about the common good. That road connects many communities. So, because of one building, we must still go ahead and do what we have to do.
In a number of states, there have been cases of successor/predecessor rift. Do you rule out such crisis happening in Lagos State?
Our own is a bit different because the governor is my principal. If we didn’t fight all these years we have been working together, why would we disagree when we are handing over? If the goal is to run a state, then what is the problem? The responsibility is so huge that you can’t do it alone, that is why you have Commissioners, Special Advisers, Special Assistants. Even with that, there are still gaps. So, what is the fight about? That doesn’t mean we don’t have disagreements about issues. And it is about, we want to do this, should we do it this way? At the executive council meeting, we argue, fight, abuse each other. But at the end of the day, we conclude and move on. Governor Sanwo-Olu and I have been friends for years. When I came back, became Commissioner, Governor Sanwo-Olu was already a Commissioner. The current CBN Governor left the administration as Commissioner for Economic Planning. So Governor Sanwo-Olu was the acting Commissioner for economic planning when I joined the cabinet. For some reason, the day I was to be sworn in, it was Governor Sanwo-Olu that was taking me round and showing me the offices and MDAs in the Secretariat before I went to my own Ministry of Science and Technology. And that was the first time I would meet him, and we have been friends since then. Thankfully, we don’t have that crisis in Lagos.
Deputy Governors have this tag of being ‘spare tyres’ and only function at the mercy of their principal. Would you canvass for Constitutional roles for Deputy Governors?
You can’t legislate common sense. So, even if you say legislation gives roles, it doesn’t prevent crisis. You cannot legislate simple good behaviour. If you have people who are jointly on a ticket, it is clear that you must work together. But, thankfully in Lagos, Deputy Governors have various responsibilities in ministries. I think Senator Oluranti Adebule was in charge of Ministry of Education, Adejoke Orelope-Adefulire was in charge of Ministry of Women Affairs and Poverty Alleviation, Adebisi Sosan was also in charge of Education, I am in charge of Works, and Science and Technology. So, for Works, Science and Technology, before the governor approves their memo, it must be signed by me. So, I’m certainly not a spare tyre and I will not treat my deputy as a spare tyre because she is not. She is an intelligent woman that establishes herself well. And the component that we really need to work on is our youth. How do we develop their future? We have issues of youth engagement, development, employment creation. Can a governor do all these by himself? One of the books I love reading is “Ego is the enemy.” Ego is the problem.
Wars were started by ego. Great companies collapse because of ego. If you are able to manage your ego in life, all the crisis will not happen. We have a job to do. It is a lot of work. So, if you have someone supporting you to do the job, what should be the problem? You must even encourage that person to help you do more.
What is your plan for the three terminals at Oshodi? At the outset, it was organised but it has now become a shadow of what former Governor Akinkunmi Ambode did.
Interestingly, as Commissioner for Works, I designed that place. I did it with Prof Olusanya of the University of Lagos. The essence is to develop similar things across different parts of Lagos. For example, in London, when you want to go to New York, you go to 34 Street. So, why is it that we have about 260 locations where you can take buses to get out of Lagos? It is disorganisation. Again, let us organise. It is for safety. If everybody queues in Oshodi, and there are manifests, Mr A is going to Osogbo, he takes this bus. If something happens, we know whom to ask. It’s being used but we need to better organise it. And it’s being used not just for buses going outside Lagos, but also intra transportation. That’s the decision we need to make. Do we totally separate intra from inter transportation? Those are the discussions that will have to happen. And we need to have, maybe nothing as big as that, in other areas of the state, like hubs. This is so that, if I am coming from Epe, I should be able to go somewhere, park my car and move and come back and meet my car, even if I have to pay.
There remains the issue of voter apathy. In the interest of democracy, what must be done to improve voter turnout in the next election?
It’s a really bad situation. In most local governments in Lagos State, the highest turnout in the last election was about 18 per cent, which I think was Ikorodu LGA. It is horrible and we need to improve on it. People have given all sorts of reasons for voter apathy, like lack of trust, people don’t see the benefit of democracy. In the United States, most people don’t pay attention to election until maybe three, four weeks. If you are in New York City, and gather 100 people who are New Yorkers and ask them who their governor is, 80 per cent don’t know their governor, because they don’t see it as their business. A lot of them are one issue voter. One is voting only because a candidate is pro-life, the other is voting a candidate because of Israel. You therefore realise that democracy, in itself, has limitations, as a wise man’s vote is the same as a not-so-wiseman’s vote. Therefore, we must get to everybody to convince them on the need to vote. A lot of people aggrieved won’t do anything that is why it is important you let people feel part of the process. But, of course, I will encourage people to vote for me and my party. If we can raise it from 18 per cent to 35 per cent, I’m sure that our votes will be very high.
Lagos also battles recurring incidents of collapsed buildings. How is this to be addressed?
There are two types. There are old buildings. There are very old buildings that can also collapse. I think the way to avoid that is to keep checking. But, Lagos is a big place. We have over 890,000 buildings. So, it becomes difficult. How many are the civil servants that are checking? So, what we rely on, a lot of the time, is people within the community, and then we go and do structural tests. So, old buildings can collapse. The ones that we are trying to totally eliminate is new constructions. There is no reason in the world why we should allow new constructions to collapse. And that’s why we are doing the Certified Accreditors Programme. And then when we zone the whole of Lagos into 10 zones or 20 zones, and then we have all these registered CAPs. If you want to build, they’ll be there. So, these are the people that will do the certification. So that we know. So, if anything happens, those private companies will be held responsible because you are supposed to be an engineer. So, the challenge also is to make sure that we don’t build the way we build. Like I said earlier, just building block by block here and there, just getting one person in the corner to do your drawing. No. You must be certified so that you don’t build something that will kill you. But as government, we also know that the city is developing at a very high rate. We cannot be using civil servants to monitor everything. Let us even give out a big component to private sector, register them, and that process is almost completed.
